The Hot Topic Returns

[Nag]

 

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Readers debate the pros and cons of PC gaming and how it compares to consoles, in terms of performance and value for money.

 

The subject for this weekend’s Inbox was inspired by reader David and asked if you own a gaming PC and if so how much did you pay for it and how well does it run modern games? If you don’t own a gaming PC what would make you consider it and what has put you off so far?

 

The majority of responses were from PC owners, most of who, as you’d expect, preferred them to consoles. Although there were also plenty of console owners who were put off by the vagaries of PC components and preferred the simplicity of consoles.

 

[OCH]

I don't own one and I wouldn't. Too many bells and whistles when it comes to PC's and their upgrades. Maybe it is because I started gaming with consoles. Meanwhile I didn't really use a PC for much of anything until the early 2000's, but everything about keeping PC's upto date, seems so daunting and expensive.

[DANGERMAN]

I played on computers on and off as a kid, but didn't get in to upgrading or anything, in fact I don't really remember messing with sound drivers and the like. Although I do remember Tomb Raider 2 running really badly and I didn't know to drop the settings down 

 

When I moved out of my parents I took the pc (they used it as an excuse to get a fancy new laptop between them), that was probably the point I got more in to pc. When that started packing up I bought my own, then went and got a better graphics card to put in there. From there I really got in to it around the back half of the PS3/360 generation, where it was just cheaper and better to play on pc. Better looking and better running games for sometimes half the price. When the PS4 launched my pc was already more powerful than it, same for the Pro. Less so now, the new consoles are a proper step up 

 

For the most part pc is really simple and convenient now. While Steam and Nvidea are big parts of that, the blurred lines between console and pc is a huge part, as is the types of game people play. I've had conversations about gaming pcs for people's kids so they can play Fortnite. You don't need a particularly powerful pc to play everything now, it's all so scalable 

 

That all being said, my pencilled in upgrades only got part done last year. I put in a new motherboard, ram and a new cpu, I've since put in an NVMe drive (a new type of ssd), but I didn't replace the graphics card like I thought I might. Granted, it was that or a PS5, and I don't desperately need one, my GTX1080 still does everything I need it to, just without Ray Tracing, but then, currently, how many games really use that. This all being said, I could see that being an upgrade that happens this year, possibly with a new monitor to better take advantage of it 

[one-armed dwarf]

I paid about 40% of the cost of a PC for my brother a couple months ago, picked the parts out for him cause he doesn't know where to start (he's got a 3700x, 1660 super. Pretty good mobo/PSU). The CPU should probably last the gen (if not there's another gen on that mobo socket), the GPU will get an upgrade in a couple years when he needs it. There was just no hope in waiting for a 3060 or something like that cause they are impossible to get. While I do think the cost is high I like the platform for those in-place upgrades you can do versus the extremely weird approach consoles now have with half step consoles which require updates for games to unlock very specific modes which use some of the extra hardware (and most of the time it's just higher resolution/super sampling you get, or a higher framerate mode. You might not want either of those). Especially now with ray tracing, yes it's not really used that often and probably isn't worth it just yet but you just know that the new consoles are going to have to get a boosted version again cause RT on AMD is quite far behind for now, even on Nvidia it's still only getting there.

 

I think mostly it's about being able to make decisions around the hardware like that and how you want to use it. As well as not being locked into ecosystems, except even now that is happening with Epic and Ubisoft Connect but at least you still have lots of other stuff you can do like run discord outside a game and VC with people. That in particular is the reason I dropped FFXIV on PS4 cause it made raiding such a pain, having to use my phone.

[Nag]

I'm a console gamer, always have been always will be (as long as consoles keep getting made anyway)... say what you will about mid gen upgrades and what not but they are still less fuss than a pc. Hook it up and stick an ethernet cable in, that's pretty much job done.

 

I like easy.

[radiofloyd]

Bought a gaming PC in 2015 and still use it regularly. It was pretty top of the range at the time, now it is still good enough to play Cyberpunk on medium settings. I have far too many games on Steam, Epic and GOG to ever consider giving up PC gaming. But getting a new one is not a high priority.

[spatular]

A long time ago i was mainly a pc gamer, used to play a lot of racing games like grand prix 2, and grand prix legends. Always have a pc for internet, emulation, and watching tv, but the older they get the less gaming they get used for. Got a new one in 2019 so at the moment im playing stuff on pc quite a lot, but before that my old pc was mostly ~8 years old so wasnt getting used for gaming loads. Ill probably look to upgrade the graphics card when its 4 years old or so. I like consoles too so thats why i dont keep the pc completely up to date, as they get older i just play on consoles more, and pc’s can be pretty expensive. Theres less pc exclusives these days, but there are some, like crimzon clover has only just come out on switch after about 5 years, and im not sure if/when art of rally is coming to consoles. And often games are cheaper on pc, although im not sure if thats changing as recently ones ive wanted haven't been any cheaper.

remember i wanted an n64 at launch but couldnt afford it (or more accurately sold loads of lego so had enough money but stupidly spent it on something else) but later on got to play some mario on ultraHLE (pc emulator), it was so good i had to go and get an n64, at which point they were £70, and i had a part time job.

 

also glad im not trying to buy pc components at the moment as it sounds like a nightmare, seemingly worse availability than the new consoles, and now a new mining craze.

 

edit - oh yeah id always agree pc’s can be a faf sometimes compared to consoles, but over the years theyve become a lot better in that regard.

 

edit 2 - i think why i was a pc gamer originaly was more my parents were happier to spend money on a pc as it could be used for educational/useful stuff too, any more console stuff we had back then was out of date by the time we got it, and/or hand me downs from family, like we had an atari 2600 that was given to us by my dads sister, and we had a master system when everyone else seemed to have mega drives.

[Sly Reflex]

It's a question of two halves really.

 

Consoles are very expensive. On the surface they're not, but when you start adding shit up they become exorbitantly expensive. As time has progressed they've taken all the good things about consoles and folded in the worst parts of PC. They don't have the nice parts of PC though. If a game is running like a dog I can't alter settings. I'm not talking about an on/off switch for performance settings. I think it's important to point out that if you've never played on a PC how important this is, and also how if you are console only you just live with it. It's the hand you've been dealt so you live with it. But you don't have to accept this hand. Mainly because it's really rubbish and they've sold you a lie.

 

Playing on PC has a fallacy of being hard. It isn't. Out of all the games I've played since making the jump, a minority have caused me enough issues where I've had to go into the settings and have a poke around. We're talking 2 or 3 out of hundreds. I do not have a powerful PC by any standards now, but when you boot into a game now, it looks at your hardware and sets up for you the best it can. You don't have to go into that, you will more than likely get a benchmark that will run the game better than it would on consoles.

 

Playing on PC has a fallacy of being expensive. Yes, it can be, in fact if you wanted you could spend an absurd amount of cash if you wanted to. But you can game on a budget. Will it be as slick as the Xbox and PS5 is now, maybe not. But depending where you jump on the train it will be. Depends when the metaphorical train leaves the station. The cost comes down if you already have a computer for general use too. There's also a fallacy of needing to upgrade every 6 month, which is really fucking stupid. This is like buying a new car every registration plate. You will get by fine on a game ready system for a while.

 

All the other things I hear. "I like to play on the tv" Yes, you can do this. "I like to play with a pad", well good news, you can play with any pad you like. Plus you have the added boon of those mouse and keys games that get pad controls forced in them being made playable too. "Getting the games is to complicated", it's a few click and it installs. "I can't be doing with the updates" Well everything updates on it's own accord, sometimes you might get caught out by an update, but they never really prevent you from playing. Might get the intrusive "your PC needs to update" sometimes though, but it'll never kick you out like LIVE or PSN would. Really the only excuse is exclusives, which is a pull, but one that's falling apart as more and more titles make the jump.

 

Then there's the flexibility around it. If I go anywhere where game clients can be installed, I can play. For free. No subs or any of that bullshit. Anything you plug in will work, be it a mic, headset, pads, wheels or whatever really. Fucking hell, you see people playing games using banana and potatoes. The sky's the limit for that stuff if you can be bothered to work it out.

 

Also, not that it's really applicable to anyone here, but if you really get into something like driving sims, PC really is the only place you can do the whole cockpit, wheel, pedals, multiscreen stuff. If you're really really into it. There's a lot of ridiculous sims.

 

Everything is back compatible. Although sometimes you need to do a bit of jiggling to get it to work. In fact there's nothing better than going back to an old favourite with new hardware.

 

Plus mods. A lot of games are easy to mod. Some are just a click, some need a bit of know how, and some are bastards to mod. But pretty much everything can be altered. We get PTE's and updates earlier as well.

 

PC life is pretty good. I think a lot of you console diehards would be surprised if you made the jump. The only issue I had was it fractured my social circle of who I played games with, but then again this happened on the generational jump, and it'd probably happen every generational jump anyway. Even on PC I guess, where generations are more granular. One thing I do think consoles do better is the invite system. Over in PC world we have a lot of different ways of doing it, the more traditional games tending to have the most archaic stuff. It's a price we pay for having dedicated servers, but yes, this is a lot simpler on console where you press a uniform button and they get a uniform invite. Not worth £40+ a year for, but hey, I'll give you that win.

 

I stand by it though, PC is really fucking nice, and although it might not be as shiny as the consoles that just came out, it won't be long until the norm is back in front. If we can ever get some GPU's from the scalpers and bitcoin miners, or course.

[one-armed dwarf]

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Everything is back compatible. Although sometimes you need to do a bit of jiggling to get it to work. In fact there's nothing better than going back to an old favourite with new hardware.

This is like the biggest thing and also the most underremarked thing. You do not need to wait years and years for EA to pull their finger out and realise people would like to play smoother versions of Mass Effect, you can get those games right now. Maybe the new trilogy will have new features but for the most part every 'remaster' you see on console is like the equivalent of playing an older game with newer hardware on PC. I think Cyberpunk 2077 is the most galling example of this right now, people on consoles straight up can't play the next gen version of that game yet even tho the hardware they have could handle it just fine. Not like the next gen version fixes all its issues, but it's still a very different feeling kind of game. I've a FFXIV friend who can't wait for the ps5 version of that game just so he can play it reliably at 60fps-1440, but like he already has the hardware that can do that. Hopefully the way MS are handling BC now means this will be less of a thing going forward.

 

On the invite system the way I see it everything just needs to implement discord by this point. Every gaming community on PC has a discord and even if you play the console version if the game is multi-plat all those people will be on DC, not the in-ecosystem chat feature.

 

I still don't know I quite agree that PC works out cheaper in the end however. Maybe with the price increases of all the online gaming subs maybe it comes to that point eventually if you never purchase another upgrade in a generation cycle. But the lifespan of hardware doesn't seem to quite match consoles, especially if you go Nvidia (to be clear I'm talking about performance and drivers, not hardware breaking down). AMD to their credit seem to do slightly better with long term support from what I've seen. 

[Sly Reflex]

Yeah, it's the subs and the increased prices of games. £40+ a year (x2 if you're on both consoles) is a lot of fucking cash. Paying an extra £10 on top of your game because it's on console is also mental, especially so since it's often more through the LIVE and PSN services. I remember looking at Division 2 when it came out on digital and it was like £75 for the digital vanilla version with a few digital extras tacked on. That is insane. Not to single D2 out, all of them were at it. Those premiums add up.

 

I went through and added up everything I spent over the last few gens and it was incredible. Multiple consoles that broke and needed replaced, slims/pros, all the bolt ons and subs. Outlays tend to be way higher for PC if you're going all out, but you recoup over time.

 

Discord is such a nice boon. It should be on everything. Although it does make me wonder when they will sell up and the next company will ruin it. I know MS was interested at one point.

[Nag]

Even with all those good points made i still have zero interest in gaming on a pc... and I don't think there's anything that could be said that would change my mind. Even knowing that most Xbox exclusives will end up on there and there's a good chance PlayStation exclusives will follow suit I'd still prefer to own both consoles.?‍♂️

[one-armed dwarf]

Well that's too bad Nag, I'll just be over here playing as Leon in a thong being chased around RPD by Thomas the Tank Engine with all the sound effects replaced by voice clips from Ed, Edd n Eddy

[Nag]

I'll admit the DMX and Thomas mods are ace....?

[Maryokutai]

I used to play a couple of MMOs (mainly Guild Wars) and Point & Click adventures on PC, two genre that just work better on that system. I also had a short-lived Unreal Tournament phase, but I think shooters work just as well on consoles (since everyone has the same "handicap" anyway).

 

That said I've kind of stopped with those games and playing on PC altogether of the simple reason that I'm already sitting 8+ hours in front of one to work and can't be bothered to go home and sit in the same position for another couple of hours again just to play a game. I know I could hook it to my TV but at that point why not just play on a console. Plus those are easier to setup and just overall less stuff to worry about.

 

That doesn't mean I will never again play on PC but I've just organically moved away from it. I also use a Mac in private and I'd probably need to buy a completely new one to play something because you can't really upgrade these things (mine's an i7 with 16GB RAM from 2014 which was ridiculous back then and still holds up for image and video editing stuff, but the graphics card is poop so I can't play anything more modern than PS360 gen games on it anyway).

[mfnick]

I don’t like playing on PC’s. I have wish I did, the positives are numerous - 60fps much more attainable, backwards compatibility, cheaper games etc. But I just don’t. I can’t even explain why but I just don’t ever feel comfortable on them. 
 

Plus for me I couldn’t do with the ability to upgrade them. As soon as a game said it couldn’t do ultra settings anymore I’d be furious and have to upgrade again. I’d be broke within the year. On a console, you can’t do anything about it so I’m not as bothered. 
 

& regardless of how much easier PCs  are these days it’s still a far cry from the consoles. Take BC for example, I tried playing HotD Overkill on new laptop and I had to fuck about for over 30 minutes trying to get it to work & googling what was up with it. Plus I want to play on my TV - yes you can now but don’t the big picture modes still have issues? Plus HDR is much less of a thing and as I’ve said many times before, when that’s done right it’s far more impressive then resolution and slightly better graphics. 
 

As big and ugly as the PS5 is, it’s still

smaller than a PC tower too. No way would I get away with fitting a PC under Tv. 
 

I also really like trophies and achievements. I genuinely get more out of my games with them. Always miss them when playing in Switch too. Steam achievements are bullshit so no point in mentioning them. Too easy to cheat them and they somehow feel far more worthless.

[Sly Reflex]

Achievements are worthless anyway. But it's not like you have to cheat to unlock them. I honestly have no idea why so many people get hooked up on them. I was once and now I look back on it and realise what a twat I was being.

[mfnick]

I’m not hooked on them anymore but I still really like them & miss them when they’re not there. 
 

Great excuse to keep playing a game I really like to get them too. 
 

I don’t get how “proud” and snobbish some people seem to be about not liking them anymore. Not aimed at you btw. Just saying. 

[one-armed dwarf]

My prob with achievements is they no longer seem as creative and cool as they did in 2006-08. I remember the Half Life games and Dead Rising having some really good ones. Now it's just grinding it feels like. Even when I got the platinum in DMC5 (brag btw) it didn't have much sense of accomplishment cause it forced me to S rank every mission even the easy ones. I want the game to ask me to do weird shit like beat a boss with a single style with no damage or something, not just grind like a MMO.

 

I did say I will try and pick up a PS5 after seeing the trailer for FFVII DLC but one other thing I'm not looking forward to is saying goodbye to gsync. I have to say that VRR is a much bigger deal than I'd expected, 60fps no longer has to be a dealbreaker. But the weirdness of how it is supported across consoles and TVs is offputting for me. 

 

also I think I agree with sly that minds would be changed by some time spent with a high end PC, by high end really just mean anything that can outperform a PS4 Pro. Laptops have their own limits (built in screen, thermal throttling, downclocked components)

[Nag]

1 hour ago, mfnick said:

Great excuse to keep playing a game I really like to get them too. 

 

Yep.?

[DisturbedSwan]

Interesting topic, and one that I've got a lot to say on. 

 

Been primarily a console gamer all my life, I had a brief spell trying to get into PC Gaming in 2003-2005ish when I got a pre-built PC as a Birthday present and had a few cool experiences with it like playing through Max Payne 2 and such but it never quite fully clicked with me (Steam had just launched but wasn't a store or anything like it is now, it was just needed to launch Valve games) and when I stupidly upgraded to Windows Vista it turned incredibly slow and cumbersome, resulting in it mainly becoming a paperweight. 

 

Fast forward to 2014 and I had been disappointed that the new next gen systems couldn't run games in full HD at 60fps so I decided to invest in a PC, buying another Prebuild from Scan. Thankfully had a much better time with it this time around and absolutely adored it, everything is so much simpler now with updates being tied to Steam, Origin, uPlay, EGS etc. meaning everything just updates seamlessly like it does on consoles as soon as you turn on your PC and all the launchers boot up in the background. Things like selecting a resolution, frame rate and different graphical settings are so much easier with select presets available and some games putting a little picture in the bottom right showing exactly what the graphical changes you're making will look like. Nvidia GeForce now makes driver updates seamless to for your graphics card, boot that up, download the new driver or driver update and away you go. 

 

Since the start of the last year though I've found myself gravitating back to the console sphere, in part this is due to wanting to play games in the living room sitting next to the missus rather than being relegated to the cold spare room to play stuff but the main reason is monetary.

 

PCs biggest issue is that all games are digital and you can't sell them on once you're done. I know games tend to be cheaper on PC but when I can buy a new game for £40 and sell it for £30-£35 on eBay a couple weeks later there's just no contest, if I'd of stayed on PC I wouldn't of been able to buy as many new games as I have done the past 18 months or so and I wouldn't of been able to save anywhere near as much money for my Wedding next year. So at the moment my PC is largely untouched and unloved, I can't even remember the last time I booted it to play a game in all honesty.