The Hot Topic Returns

[one-armed dwarf]

Fwiw Valheim is IMO a game which leverages old style visuals really poorly. The modern lighting and (imo) ps1 looking textures create a kinda disharmonious juxtaposition. Or sometimes it looks like BOTW but grainy. Also yes it made me feel sick while playing, I explained in that thread that the camera motion and visuals made me unwell.

 

Valheim is like it's trying to be like Minecraft but Minecraft is simple rather than ugly imo and the RTX version makes it beautiful. Its retro graphics 'chic' and modern graphics sitting alongside in a more successful way than Valheim manages.

[Maryokutai]

I don't think there's a game I once considered visually stunning that I now find hilariously ugly. Objectively speaking there might be a ton, but I can't just look at these games in a vacuum, I always have to consider the hardware they were running on initially. No matter how dated Starfox or Gran Turismo look from today's perspective, I'm still baffled at what they managed to get out of these systems back in the day. There was a phase a couple of years ago when I disliked the 32bit era look, but I've come to really appreciate it. As blocky as the first TR were, there's a certain sense of mystique portrayed throughout those games that's completely absent from later generations, because the developers started filling those blanks space you used to fill yourself with your imagination.

 

I think that's also the reason why I've always enjoyed playing handheld games. Technically they've always been dated by the time they first released but there's just something about developers bypassing all these limitations and building something beautiful with a couple of hundred pixels, even less colours and some MIDI tones.

[Nag]

 

Quote

Readers celebrate the 35th anniversary of The Legend Of Zelda, by naming their favourite entries and their hopes for the future.

 

The subject for this week’s Hot Topic is something Nintendo didn’t mention themselves during the recent Nintendo Direct but which readers certainly had something to say about, as we asked to hear your memories of the series and its games.

 

Most people hadn’t started with the original NES game but instead reminisced about A Link To the Past, Ocarina Of Time, and the other classics of Nintendo’s iconic franchise.

 

Darksiders.

[OCH]

I started the series with Zelda 2. But my favourite hasn't changed since 2000. Majora's Mask is still the very best Zelda I've ever played and one of my top Action RPG's too. 

That said, since Twilight Princess I've felt the series has begun to become one of diminishing returns. Skyward Sword was lame and hampered by gimmicks. BoTW was the least Zelda-like entry in the series I've ever played. In as much I think you could have changed the protagonist character model (plus name references) and it could have been anything.

 

Oddly enough don't have much hope for the series right now. Until Aonuma leaves.

 

51 minutes ago, Nag said:

Darksiders.

You jest, but which one?

[mfnick]

Must be the first, the others moved away from the Zelda structure. Following on from Nags post, mines Okami ?

 

Seriously though, my first was Link to the Past which I enjoyed but found a bit too confusing and always got lost as a kid. Played it later and though it was good but not amazing. Favourite is Ocarina of Time by far. At the time I agreed completely with all the best game of all time accolades but I’ve not really enjoyed any of the others in the series since. 

[Nag]

31 minutes ago, OCH said:

You jest, but which one?

 

The first probably, haven't played the third.

[Maryokutai]

1 hour ago, OCH said:

 

Oddly enough don't have much hope for the series right now. Until Aonuma leaves.

 

And yet Majora's Mask was Aonuma's first Zelda as a lead director.

 

Looking at the whole Zelda franchise from a distance it's a perfect example of how people never really know what they want. The consensus was that Zelda games always were the same despite everyone clearly having a favourite and a most hated version, and then comes Breath of Wild which suddenly isn't enough Zelda anymore.

 

I think Aonuma does an excellent job as a patron of the franchise. Every game since OoT felt very different, with Twilight Princess the obvious exception as it simply tried to be OoT 2.0. But that also was by design and not a byproduct of a lack of creativity.

 

Anyway. Favourite Zelda-Zelda: Breath of the Wild. Favourite non-Zelda-Zelda: Beyond Good & Evil.

[mfnick]

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haven't played the third.

 

 

The third is fantastic but its Metroid and Souls like, not Zelda. 

[OCH]

14 minutes ago, Maryokutai said:

And yet Majora's Mask was Aonuma's first Zelda as a lead director.

Indeed. Yet I think the series since, also demonstrates the Miyamoto effect. Not knowing when to step back and let someone else take the reigns.

[one-armed dwarf]

Zelda II is the one I would most like to try cause it looks like such weird bullshit. I think I gave it a go on the Switch online thing before but could not figure out what it wanted me to do.

[OCH]

Zelda II is very.. obtuse. Honestly I think the one thing that really hampers its potential enjoyment is the hitbox of the sword being far smaller than it should have been. Aside from that, the weirdness of it actually adds to the charm.

[bellow]

I'd say Ocarina, BotW, link between worlds are my favourites.

 

If pushed I'd also admit that my truly favourite 'Zelda' is also my favourite Zelda clone, Okami.

[OCH]

I loved Okami, I'd rate it a lot higher if the game finished at Orochi. The Yami part, being in Okami 2 instead.

[Sly Reflex]

LttP and MM for me.

 

If we're naming similar games, does Beyond Good and Evil count?

[DANGERMAN]

6 hours ago, mfnick said:

Must be the first, the others moved away from the Zelda structure. Following on from Nags post, mines Okami ?

 

yeah, Okami for me too

 

Actual Zelda games, Windwaker by a distance, then whichever is shortest

[OCH]

It really is a shame Okami didn't really take off like it deserved to. Such a great game.

[AndyKurosaki]

I’ve not played many of them, to be honest. Link To The Past was my first, and I absolutely loved it. I also really enjoyed Wind Waker. 
That’s pretty much it, really. I tried Ocarina, well the GameCube port of it. I had no nostalgia for it, as I never played it on N64. And I very quickly lost interest, as it looked dreadful. Normally graphics don’t bother me. But I just couldn’t get into it at all.

[one-armed dwarf]

I couldn't get into it either. Not cause of graphics but it's too basic. I get it probably set some fundamentals for moving and fighting stuff in open world 3d games but I think the 2D games are a lot better to play tbh. I wonder if that's a controversial opinion.

[OCH]

Now there are more of each type, I tend to split the difference. To me, LTTP is the very best of the 2D games. Nearly perfect and accidental sequence breaking only enhances that. 

Whereas MM is the top of the 3D games. Nothing else in the series quite has the same tone, level of world building and real stakes to it.

[Sly Reflex]

LttP really is a tour de force in design. I mean it's nothing special in the way that it moves until you start comparing it with games from that time, it's just so silky smooth to play. It's got solid rules that it never fucks about with either, when you're looking at puzzles and are struggling to figure them out it's a you problem, not a game problem. Games often fall into the esoteric bullshit for puzzles, LttP sidesteps around this, but makes stuff look more complicated than it is until you know the answer to it.

 

It's just the whole package really. It looks fantastic. It's got great music. It's a challenge, but not overtly so. It's got loads of optional stuff should you want to go do that, but it's never outstaying its welcome. I'd rank it up there with one of the finest games ever put together.

 

The only thing that bothers me about it is that you have to do a lot of juggling with items at points. More to do with hardware limits though, those controllers only had so many buttons.