Marvel Cinematic Universe

[one-armed dwarf]

To be perfectly honest about it I hadn't even heard about this fucking movie until this week. 

 

I think it's more a sense of growing disinterest than 'alt right' that is the problem here

[OCH]

A sentiment I've been hearing a lot recently is that there should have been a pause.

1. Phase out the Avengers story IE Endgame and the TV shows

2. Scale back the MCU EG Ending of Spider-Man: No Way Home cutting the ties with the old MCU.

3. Return of the MCU with the Fantastic Four, X-Men etc

 

The "Multiverse Saga" such as it is, I don't think has worked. There wasn't a underlying narrative to the whole thing. Eternals, Moonknight, Werewolf By Night and even She-Hulk, should have either come before Endgame or after this Saga. Because they don't really connect to the overarching theme. Each was a standalone story that, like the Deadpool Movies, could viewed in isolation. The normies were never going to hang around forever. They needed (and seemingly failed) to foresee that writing on the wall.

 

Oh and I finally got around to watching Quantumania. It's fine, a solid 7/10. I don't get the hate for it? It's as middle of the road as the other Ant-Man films. Kang is done well, the humour wasn't. The latter is the real underlying theme of the MCU.

[DisturbedSwan]

I think the pause was 2020/2021 during the pandemic really. I think folks just really loved those characters, got so attached to them, loved them, cried for/with them, felt for them and all that jazz, it was like a big family, so when all those characters were gone and endgame was such a definitive ending that what came after has felt like Marvel scrambling about to put together something people will care about again and failing really.

 

There has definitely been too many TV shows which has been an oversaturation for sure, some of them like Wandavision have been excellent but a lot of them have been merely middling (hello Secret Invasion), I know a lot came out recently that they don't have a typical TV show setup for those shows and more of a movie setup, without showrunners and all that jazz.

 

It's still too early to tell with the multiverse saga really, the little threads at the end of Loki S1, Doctor Strange 2, Wandavision, No Way Home etc. have been satisfying but it hasn't gone behind that. I think the issues surrounding Kang's actor Jonathan Majors is a hindrance too as they still don't really know whether to go ahead basing this whole saga off him or not until the result of his court case.

 

I think this year has been a slight resurgence thanks to GotG3 which felt like a return to that Marvel pedigree, next year with Deadpool 3 etc. and some more of the X-Men characters interactions it should be better. Once Fantastic Four and the X-Men are brought into the fold in the build up to Secret Wars and the Kang dynasty (if the latter even goes ahead) (assuming each of the solo films are done well) then it will be firing on all cylinders again as it's clear the newer characters people don't care as much about.

 

I also thought Ant-Man 3 wasn't bad, it was middling and a bit of a mess but it wasn't bad by any means.

[OCH]

31 minutes ago, DisturbedSwan said:

merely middling (hello Secret Invasion)

That is very charitable for SI. I would agree there has been too many shows. But that was always going to be a Disney problem (points to Star Wars).

 

It's also been a really weird time for the whole Phase thing. Which I don't think has helped. The phase structure up until this point led to a resolution movie.

 

MCU Phase 4: Werewolf by Night, Eternals, Shang Chi, Thor: L&T, Black Widow, Dr. Strange 2, Spider-Man: NWH, GoTG Special & Vol. 3, Quantumania and Black Panther 2. Which was the end of Phase 4.

 

Narrative through line? Wakanda Forever being a resolution to any of the above?? Basically they shot themselves in the foot here. Mudding the water. Probably should have kept Ant-Man 3, Spidey 3 and Dr. Strange 2 as the latter three films. Building towards the Multiverse Saga.

 

[Jimboxy]

27 minutes ago, OCH said:

But that was always going to be a Disney problem (points to Star Wars

I'd actually argue that what they've done with Star Wars regarding the shows has led to the best Star Wars content for some considerable time. It doesn't feel like it has been over saturated like the MCU does, and at least 75% of those shows have been good to great (Obi Wan and Book of Boba, I'm looking at you), and it generally feels like a good course correct for what they're doing with the Star Wars universe. I think a lot of that is down to Dave Filoni.

 

With regards to MCU, I think it was also going to struggle post Endgame as it was so big and managed to land a pretty satisfying conclusion to a decade long movie saga, which is a pretty amazing feat really. That being said, I didn't expect the quality of content post Endgame to be this all over the shop. Very few of the films have been that good, most pretty average and some just bad (hello Eternals) and the TV show quality has also fluctuated wildly as well, but worst of all, just been a bit dull as well, none of it has been as good as MCU at its peak.

 

I'm not really sure what they can do moving forward, all the multiverse stuff is pretty exhausting and reeks of them trying to integrate as many characters and IPs as possible, it doesn't have a neat through line like you got with the infinity stones. Kang could be great, but as said above, is currently over shadowed by claims against the actor (side point, they should probably just digitally bulk up the actors in post, hasn't it been speculated with a few MCU actors that they are juicing to get bulked up for roles, which comes with side effects), it's all just a bit of a mess.

 

That being said, I'm quite looking forward to Marvel's. We just wrapped up Ms Marvel the other night and both me and my wife really enjoyed it, probably one of our favourite MCU shows. It helps that my wife is Pakistani Muslim, so all the cultural references just landed so well.

[OCH]

I tried the first couple episodes of Ms Marvel. But it came across as too YA for me. In light of Secret Invasion, I will go in with that level of trepidation when it comes to future shows from now on.

 

A line in the sand should have definitely been drawn though. GoTG3, Thor: L&T, Black Panther 2 and even Spider-Man NWH all act as endings (or new beginnings) for those characters. Maybe that should have been the theme of Phase 4. Then give it a break until all the legal stuff over X-Men casting expires. Then kick off MCU 2.0.

 

The fact that rumours persist of RDJR and Chris Evans being asked to reprise their roles reeks of studio panic. That doesn't bode well for the current course of the MCU.

[OCH]

Loki Season 2 - Episode 2-6

Glorious Purpose

This is not only the best of the TV shows. But probably the best MCU project overall. Season One wasn't bad, by any means. But it did take a little while to build momentum and find it's feet. Season Two is almost flawless. Writing, characterisation and execution. Episodes five and six, which I watched back to back, were simply outstanding. This is how to do (and achieve) a lot with a minimal cast. To discuss either in a meaningful way, be that spoilers etc would literally ruin someone else's experience. Which I would never do. Watch it all and enjoy 10/10

[one-armed dwarf]

I am one episode from the end of that and its the most leaden boring nonsense marvel has done. Its tv as MCU homework. Endless exposition, dour faced characters talking boringly about timey wimey shite. Jonathan Majors hamming it up in comically bad form. Posting this from a coma/10

 

Season 1 was better id say. Tom Hiddleston carried it, but they wrote him completely charmless in S2. Same with Owen Wilson

[OCH]

 

[one-armed dwarf]

Jonathan Major's has been sacked, also got charged with third degree assault

 

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-news/marvel-drops-jonathan-majors-as-kang-1235391129/

 

Last season of Loki sort of felt weird with how it dealt with this character

[OCH]

Actually forgot Season Two (now in it's entirety) was released over December. But here is a teaser for What If? Season Three...

 

 

[Maf]

As much as I don’t think Hugh Jackman was ever especially good as Wolverine, I hope he didn’t come back for Deadpool 3 to ruin his legacy as the character. Just with the state of Marvel, and a movie so highly reliant on jokes, riffing and writing filmed during a writer’s strike, it doesn’t seem likely it will be good and it would suck for Jackman to spoil Logan with this. 
 

I mean, I suppose it’s not like he’s never been in a shitty X-Men film. It’s not a prestigious or clean legacy. But it is a long one, and Logan was a good send off. To undo that with a crappy, unfunny comedy would be pretty tragic. 
 

The costume looks sick, though, I’m glad they got that right in the end. 

[Maryokutai]

Watched Guardians 3 yesterday, as I was too tired to play Elex but not tired enough to sleep. Which I felt was the ideal state to watch current MCU stuff.

 

But the joke's on me because I actually did like it. It's hardly perfect, the villain is completely throwaway as usual, the humor not really funny most of the times (but thankfully drastically reduced compared to Vol. 2) and that certain character that was teased in the second movie might as well not have been in it. In fact I think the movie would have been better and more streamlined without him. But I did enjoy the Rocket plot and the refreshingly uncomfortable animal cruelty and body horror scenes, because it goes beyond what I'd have imagined the suits being willing to greenlight for a MCU movie. It can feel very disjointed at times and I'd be open to a 120 minute director's cut, but yeah, this was solid. 

[OCH]

7 hours ago, Maryokutai said:

the villain is completely throwaway as usual

He is rumoured to be in the running to replace Kang as the main villain of this MCU phase.

[Maryokutai]

That would be a bit weird I think. Plus from what I found out, even though the movie suggests otherwise, is

 

Spoiler

that the Diviner survives the happenings in Guardians 3. Which is some really odd, hidden back door they kept open for really no reason IMO.

 

We'll see I suppose, but I think a newcomer to the MCU IP would be a better choice.

[Maf]

The 2 rumours I keep seeing is that they will either recast Kang, or Dr Doom will takeover as the big bad from the upcoming Fantastic 4 film. 
 

I don’t care what they do, they just to find some focus again. Clearly trying to tell a cross-media, multiverse saga is more than they could handle. 
 

By the way I really loved Guardians 3. I actually think it’s the best of that trilogy  

[OCH]

To be fair, even without Majors being dropped. Kang is a really naff villain. It would have been a better choice making Red Skull the replacement. Considering he just vanishes in Endgame? Although that was a missed opportunity. Considering he was returning the Soul Stone. There should have been a confrontation between Captain America and Red Skull.

 

Also considering who is supposed to be the villain of Captain America 4, I'm surprised they are jumping the gun and considering Dr. Doom straight away.

[Maf]

Deadpool & Wolverine 

 

 

Easily the best thing related to the MCU in years already 

[Nag]

😂... looks great.

[Maryokutai]

At first glance it seems like they've been given free reign, which I think was something people were afraid they wouldn't when Disney took over. Could be cool. One thing I'd like them to do is not mention Logan at all though. I think that should always be canonically the end for Jackman's Wolverine and poking fun at it here wouldn't feel right.

 

Edit: the fact that this trailer got uploaded on Ryan Reynold's youtube account is kind of fitting and hilarious.