Street Fighter 6

[Maryokutai]

Is Kim really a good character to learn the fundamentals? From what I understand she's best when she puts the opponent in a situation that makes you feel like playing a single player game, as in your first clip. You rarely see Kims doing well when she's being forced into a tug of war in the neutral game.

 

Though I honestly don't know which character is that kind of character in 6. Juri gels the best with the new features while retaining her core identity I think but I found her super boring for some reason.

 

I was planning on trying out the new DR input changes but I think I'm just going to wait for Aki at this point as well. I doubt I'll end up enjoying her so much as to look past my grievances with the green bar, but she has a better chance at doing so than the other three at least.

[one-armed dwarf]

Kim struggles in neutral, yes her win condition is snowballing them to death in the corner but tbh the system mechanics in this game like perfect parry are a very clear and obvious answer that will shut down the single player high-low mix game and force her to stagger her pressure a bit more. I've just not got to the point yet where the gimmicks aren't successful, so it's safe jumps and DR on wakeup all day

 

And in comparison to a character like JP, who overloads the opponents' mental stack so much they forget to look at the departure spike above their head and get comboed by themselves yeah Kim is allowing me to learn lots more lol. There's a better Luke replay I could have picked where this guy called Benji was making me work for the knockdowns and I definitely wasn't bouncing them off the wall like that, but within that exercise I'm figuring out way more about how advantaged and disadvantaged certain moves are. I don't even think I saw Ken's heavy dragonlash attack until I started playing Kim and have to account for it in my approach. Ultimately long term I'll be a JP main, but the ranked grind can be dull with him in platinum

 

(I don't mean that to sound like I win loads or anything, I don't. But the wins just feel a bit gimmicky at times)

 

In general though I think when talking about the fundamentals in SF6 it is intrinsically an ignorant kind of game in the way that Strive is in that it heavily favors constant offense, with very little exception. You basically lose the match if you're in burnout unless you can squeeze out a clutch CA, and parry loses to throws. Ultimately that's just what this game is, I think. My impression of it at least. Mechanically, I sort of prefer Strive a bit tbh, its closest equivalent to DR was roman cancel but that seems a bit more versatile and not as linear as this, but I prefer every other part of this game in how it's presented and helps the player learn

[one-armed dwarf]

🐍

 

new main, sorry Kim

 

 

[one-armed dwarf]

 

Testament vibes with the poison burst stuff

[Maryokutai]

It reminded me a bit of Gill's retribution system in SFV (hitting a burning enemy with ice attacks or vice versa gave him more juggle potential and/or frame advantage).

 

I think I'm out of this game though. It may sound overly dramatic but every time I see Drive Rush happening I just want to throw up. I don't think I've ever disliked a system mechanic so strongly and it's really putting me off even thinking about re-installing to try her out.

 

Looking at it without personal bias she seems like an interesting character though and a more thought-out version of FANG. Might also end up being a relatively difficult matchup for JP, so in that sense she could shake up the pro circuit a bit.

[one-armed dwarf]

I saw a suggestion that they should make stopping drive rush a punish counter state, which seems like it would balance the risk/reward a bit better when it's between players who are a decent enough skill level. Juri's medium kick, I think it's medium kick, has two hits in it and is very active and can fish for your hurtbox that's trying to stuff it very easily. Here's a funny video of that with IDOM, I think he pressed lk and his startup frames of that check get blowed up

 

 

I think in general while they scrub up pretty well in the lower to mid levels, grappler characters in 6 aren't super privileged by how much the game rewards oppression but doesn't punish it as much. One thing I tried to get better at in the Manon matchup was keeping that in mind, and being more ignorant and random. When you play passive, you're playing their game. 

 

Interesting how drive impact sort of stops being such a problem after a point. The only time it's really threatening I think is corner situations when you're conditioned to respect the opponent's pressure. 

[Maf]

I feel like the main theme to SF6 is “Fuck Lily” lol. She was going to be my main until I saw everyone say she’s wack

 

Now the patch is out I will start playing this soon. I just want to find out who do better, Chun or Cammy and I’ll go from there (I really want it to be Cammy but her hooligan stuff sucked, right_

[Maryokutai]

Nobody's going to react with a Super to that move. At least not consistently and not at that range. Lily is actually a good beginner character because she can put the opponent in a very easy-to-execute 50:50 blender. She's a bit linear, meaning pros don't take an interest in her, but on lower levels I'd argue she's one of the better characters.

 

Chun-Li on the other hand is absolutely not for beginners.

[one-armed dwarf]

Those are modern controls players, so they're playing a different game there

 

But yeah even at that the zangief is pushing the command grab super at like the earliest frame possible

 

edit I got this wrong actually, I thought the right side of the screen was gief's input history but it's not. Still though

 

[Maf]

2 hours ago, Maryokutai said:

Nobody's going to react with a Super to that move.
 

. She's a bit linear,

I don’t think you can react to that with a super but I think there will be players out there that make that read because she’s a bit predictable on approach. It’s just the strike or throw when she gets close which makes her good

 

When I was thinking about playing Lily I watched a bit of a player called El Chaka…something. He’s really good, but even when watching I was like oh she just does 2 things.

 

I wanted to play Cammy because her Hooligan thing looks like a 3 way mix, right? Grab, cross up, double overhead? But apparently people don’t fear it at all. And when I watch matches on YT people never use it 

 

2 hours ago, Maryokutai said:

Chun-Li on the other hand is absolutely not for beginners.

Neither was Millia 😠

 

Actually Millia was never that hard to use, she was just hard to,play because she sucked in S1

[one-armed dwarf]

If I recall I think you can just jab her out of it, but Cammy still seems pretty oppressive to me. I don't really recommend making picks just based off high level play, when you're talking about players who've developed the kind of mental stack most won't ever. You can probably still fool people with Hooligan, by using it very rarely. 

 

The thing with Cammy is she can also punish overcommitment with her distance closing stuff, I think. I don't know much about playing her but I don't really see any big reason not to pick her. She seems to have pretty good space control but maybe I just suck

[Maf]

If I were going to make picks off top level play I would pick Blanka. Fucking Jesus one of the reasons I haven’t played the game is I don’t want to play against that at all

 

Or I would play DeeJay but I can’t look at those god like abs and not hate him for it 

[one-armed dwarf]

The Blankas you fight at mid level are just going to do the ball move and random command grabs over and over. Mid level (platinum-ish) SF with those characters is about learning to deal with the same gimmick over and over, see also Honda. 

 

I mean don't get me wrong, you could climb to master, I dunno, but there's just a world of difference between the brainless gimmicky Blankas and the highly technical big brain Blankas you see on those stages. By the time you get to fight players like that it's probably cause you're already really good

 

Maybe play Blanka, he's a cool character

[one-armed dwarf]

 

[Maf]

Looks so good. I really prefer the new design over the old one

 

When is the release date for Akuma? At the end it says out now, but unsure if that’s the character or the game

 

I guess he’ll be low health again, right? That’s the new thing about Akuma? Wonder how long he survives in a high damage game

 

Anyway, very cool. And I have that as part of the Season 1 pack so I might just fire it up and play a bit of Akuma just to see 

[one-armed dwarf]

May 22nd

[Maf]

SF6 has the opposite problem of Strive where there are so many characters I want to play. I like Chun-Li, Lily, Cammy, Zangief, Blanka, Rashid and now Akuma 

[one-armed dwarf]

The cast is pretty boring currently tbh, it needs a few more weirdos with unusual gimmicks. GG has that but its whole battle system doesn't reward the investment in gimmickry over straightforwardness. 

 

I'm probably going to pick up Ed as he's the most Nero-coded character on the cast, and has some light mid-screen zoning gimmicks. 

[Maryokutai]

SF rarely does weirdos and gimmicks. The likes of AKI and Akuma, in terms of gimmicks and toolsets respectively, are usually as far as the series goes. Most likely in an effort to keep the OG characters from the 90 as relevant and viable as possible without completely revamping their toolsets. You can't have two-move-Guile go up against a puppet character with multiple stances and a life-drain mechanic if you want at least some sort of an even playing field.

 

And maybe this has changed or will change with new people coming to the series, but traditionally the SF hardcore audience has reacted rather negatively towards certain experimental archetypes. Menat in SFV had a fireball that completely bypassed the classic ruleset of how projectiles work in SF and everyone despised playing against her (myself included).

 

It's the reason they completely reinvent system mechanics for every entry instead of doubling down and giving Ryu Nunchakus or something. Which is very different from a lot of other FGs who are designed around and known for their mechanics first and the character's toolsets second.

[Maf]

I think you make very valid and concise points but also they should give Ryu nunchucks, that’d be sick