God of War: Ragnarök

[AndyKurosaki]

Made a bit more progress today. Which came to a screeching halt again, because of another bloody awful puzzle section. 
 

The puzzles in this are like the platforming in Doom Eternal. They fucking suck, and I wish they’d pack it in.

[Snaggletooth]

Not looked at them myself, but I hear there are quite a few features in the asscesibility options to make parts of some puzzles easier.
That being said th design of some of them isnt alwars immediatly obvious.

 

Got caught on a couple myself and thought I had tried the correct solution but hadnt got it quite right.

The design on the puzzles isnt always well thought out, but its about my only complaint with the game so far.

[one-armed dwarf]

Found my first of the 12 'super bosses' in this game. Well, there's not much that's super about this boss, more like the baby of the supers. Anyway, 1 down 11 more bawbags to go. Maybe I will fight them, I burnt out on Valkryies pretty quick tbh.

 

I'm 20 hours into the game, this clip is from Midgard. I think that's enough hints as far as spoilers go. There is a pretty big spoiler in this video but if you're at this part or have seen one of the '12' bosses you will already know what it is.

 

 

Spoiler

 

 

[DisturbedSwan]

I definitely agree that it's so difficult to signal progress in this game, I wish there were Chapters or Acts we could allude to but I honestly don't want to say where I am or where I've been in the game without spoiler tags lol. 

So I'm about 18 hours in and I'm in Midgard at the moment having just returned from 

Spoiler

Jotunheim

 

The entire game has been nothing less than a masterpiece for me so far. The game is so well written, the characters you encounter and their dialogue is just so nuanced and well acted you sometimes forget this is a videogame and not a film or high end TV show. The incidental dialogue when roaming about the world, hearing tales from Mimir about the world and it's past are just fascinating, I have often found myself wanting to roam more just to finish the end of that particular story Mimir is telling me. 

 

Its got the perfect balance of more linear narrative focused sections that dump a whole load of lore and exposition at you whilst (of course) fighting a myriad number of different enemies and different varied open areas to explore with meaningful, well written side stories that often give you greater meaning to a narrative element or the world as a whole. This probably just echoes my first post in this thread, but yeah, things have continued masterfully as they've gone on.

 

Not had any issues with the puzzles so far, those water puzzles Andy mentioned did leave me scratching my head a tiny bit maybe but I solved them after not much time, I think in the accessibility settings you can turn off puzzles completely but I may be wrong.

 

I think Kyle is further in to this than I am, but I don't think I'm far behind, I haven't found the Valkyrie equivalents in this yet.

[one-armed dwarf]

I beat it today, 38 hours or so. All over it's quite good and I can't imagine most will walk away feeling short changed, either in gameplay or story. It's a very generously built game, tons of different enemy types being introduced all the time and a lot to chew on mechanically speaking (I played most of it on No Mercy, dropping to Story Mode for sections I found either shitty or annoying).

 

It doesn't remotely have the same impact for me as 2018 tho, which might be the most singularly impressed I've been by a modern AAA game ever. It does so much stuff right, even if it is maybe 2/3s of the game this one is in its magnitude. But imo, bigger is not always better, and most of the things this does well or even better than the original does not mean that the sum of its parts comes close to reaching the heights of 2018. Which is a weird thing for me to think about now, that 2018 remains this untouchable game for me in a series of games which I have mixed feelings on (this one) or outright dislike (the original games). 

 

I'm not saying Ragnarök is bad, but it's not really 'for me' in the sense that 2018 led me to expect. It's very much in that Sony cinematic gaming wheelhouse, lots of walk and talk and it's very indulgent with the interactive cinema moments. If you're into that you will definitely be into this. But it's full of stuff which personally I find a bit disruptive and frustrating, stuff which people who really like ND games will love. It's got this very weird 'MCU' type of energy which comes across more and more the more characters get introduced. In the 'first' game you had all the quips from the dwarves, and to an extent Mimir. But it seems near everyone in this is channeling a sort of sarcastic energy that for me takes me out of it a bit, especially the Vanaheim crew (I fucking hated Freyr). Characters tend to overly vocalise every inner thought they are having, letting you know in advance of any turns they might take or future developments cause it's so extensively signposted by their incidental (during gameplay) dialogue. I think it's a side effect partly of how big the game is, and the need to fill it with this type of thing. But it makes some potentially interesting character arcs feel a bit flattened, with regard to any sense of nuance. Which might not sound like a real problem but doesn't give people a lot to chew on when the game is all over, similar to how you walk away from a MCU film with little need to think about it other than post-credit scenes. But that's just the choice they made here, they wanted the story to be more about Atreus and everything feels a bit more 'young adult', even with all the cursing and heads being cleaved in two. In general most of the new cast are good, and I like the decision to make Odin this extremely unimpressive person in a cast of larger than life people. It serves the direction they take that guy in.

 

On the story none of it feels rushed, they try and do a ton of justice to multiple story arcs, but it gets to feel feel a bit overstuffed and weirdly paced imo compared with 2018's leaner story focused on a smaller selection of characters. Big things will happen and then they throw a curveball to take you somewhere else, and then Mimir will recommend doing side quests while the fate of the realms is in the balance. It's very choppy. Some other stuff in 2018 was a lot better, like how world changes throughout the game would change the landscape of Midgard, and your new abilities would unlock new areas to explore also. They don't have that as much here, but they did need to include 9 realms this time and doing the same trick twice wouldn't have worked as well. So they didn't make the wrong choice there, but it's another thing which contributes to the imo lesser impact this title has. 

 

On actual combat gameplay I have mixed feelings. Not mixed as in I think some of it is bad or good, but that some of it is amazing and some of it sucks. I made that point to @Nag earlier about turning the arrows off for off screen attacks, but as I went through the game I found myself having the same issues he had. The fov is too tight, and the visuals far too involved and complicated to easily read what's happening in some of these fights. This is a game where you have to carefully manage the space you're in, isolate and space out different enemies and keep them under pressure with support moves and heavy hitting aoes as need be. But the game is not visually organised enough to do this. It is pushing so many pixels that it needs to keep the fov tight as possible to keep the frame budget intact, especially for PS4. There are some really interesting designs enemies in this game but the encounters are composed of messy combinations of them with a lot of on screen noise that makes it hard to find the right way to play. Ironically I had this same visual parsing problem in Bayonetta, but it's got a different reason for it in Ragnarok. Ragnarok is also a deliberate game while Bayo is a APM game. imo Sony/SSM could find a better way here given that this is a PS4 game on a PS5 with lots of performance options, fov should also be considered a performance option. I'll stress tho this might be more of a 'high difficulty' issue, cause one or two mistakes on a higher mode with off screen shite can cost you a lot. But on standard mode, maybe not.

 

It's got a great flow mechanically speaking tho, the way you swing between axe and blades and leverage the different abilities and ways you can buff Kratos' offense. I'll get into the nitty gritty of it more with the Muspherheim trials in this I think, frustrating as I expect it to be. The one v one boss fights are mostly great, and the final gauntlet of boss fights are a level above most other games. Probably one of the better final bosses a game like this has had in a long while, better than DMC5 or the latest Bayonetta. I didn't think that the Baldur finale in 2018 was all that but they escalate the mechanics of each fight in this one in a really interesting way, and reward your understanding of the mechanics, and give you the big anime power fantasy moments you want also. The 1v1 fights throughout are really didactic in their design, meaning they want to test how you've picked up on the gameplay mechanics and if your muscle memory is settling into implementing it easily. There's a really great version of that in this fight here, which has a big story spoiler (same spoiler as the one posted above), this boss in a library. It's Ragnarök clobbering 101, do you know how and when to parry and what is safe and unsafe

 

Spoiler

 

 

I'll probably stick with it for a while before going back to bayonetta. I doubt I'll do all the post game stuff tho, the main game is just too long. It's also weirdly immersion breaking I find that the characters go on doing side quests after the main mission, it's cause they talk so much or something lol

[DisturbedSwan]

Good write up there @one-armed dwarf I haven't finished it obviously, but I definitely agree with some of what you've said being now, about 23 hours into it. It's definitely more indulgent and assured of itself than 2018, I don't really get the MCU analogy to be honest though but side and main characters definitely have a whole lot more dialogue in this, it feels a lot more ND-esque in that aspect, I even thought to myself during some of the longer cutscenes that your eyes would be glazing over or your hands reaching for the skip button during those moments. The definitely seem to be more frequent and invasive in this than 2018 but being a huge fan of cinematic-style games I've absolutely no issue with those, I think I've cried about 3 times so far lol, the mo cap performances in this are absolutely out of this world. 

 

It sounds like you both are having the kind of experience with this that I was having with 2018 (right up until the last few hours at least which turned it around for me). I haven't had any issues with the puzzles though so far and I'm usually quite dumb with those, I'm also completely the opposite with 

Spoiler

Atreus

in that I haven't fully got to grips with that move set so far whereas I feel like I've somewhat mastered the original move set so far and have a whale of a time with it, I've still not had any indicator issues either.

 

I think now I'm a little further in, it definitely suffers a bit with bloat, I finished a regions story thread yesterday 

Spoiler

(Vanaheim)

was making my way out and onto the next story objective when the side stories got introduced for this region and whole new areas open up and instead of being excited, I just kind of sighed and said to myself 'well, better do those now then', I know once I'm into them I'll lap them up and have already enjoyed getting reacquainted with a traversal mechanic in this region, but yeah I did have a bit of a sigh.

 

I was thinking to myself how similar this game is to the recent Tomb Raider trilogy and Star Wars Jedi Fallen Order, they're kind of almost interchangeable really, like super similar. But I love that design method and style of game so it's not really a complaint, it's just something I caught onto with 2018 and it's perhaps even more prominent here how similar this is to those titles. 

 

But yeah, so far I'm still in absolute awe of the game 99% of the time and can't really fault it, just some minor nitpicks really.

[DANGERMAN]

@NagI've deleted your post for spoilers. There was definitely a way to write that without spoiling it

 

Fwiw I'm not personally that annoyed because I could have guessed that happens just because it's clearly the story arc but other people definitely will be

[Nag]

Could've just spoilered it if that was the case... doesn't overly matter in any case I guess.

[DANGERMAN]

You could have, yes 😊

[Nag]

I would've, if you'd asked.😊

[DANGERMAN]

On 11/11/2022 at 07:21, DANGERMAN said:

Just a quick one, as no one has yet as far as I'm aware. Make sure you don't post any spoilers, I can see this game going a few places, so just be wary.

 

That includes if you're posting pictures elsewhere, like the screenshot thread or the completed games thread

 

Without wanting to get in to a back and forth about it, I did, on page 1. 

 

We regularly have to call people out on it, all we ask is for a bit of consideration and sense to be used, same for any of the vague rules on here 😄 you shouldn't need reminding after the fact at this point

 

Remember, any time we get a report either me, @retroedor @Jimbo Xiiihave to read it. I've got this waiting to be played, I now know something I'd ideally not know. Just ask yourself "is Ben going to get someone complaining about this", then, ideally, take sympathy on me and word things in a way that isn't going to spoil anything 

[Nag]

I genuinely have no idea if this was in the build up to the games release or not as I didn't watch any of it... so if it was supposed to be some big game changer I apologise.

 

As it is I'll just refrain from posting in this thread from now on.👍

[DANGERMAN]

Honestly I've no idea if it was, same as you I wasn't interested in watching the preview stuff because I was already going to get it, it would been no benefit to me at all

[AndyKurosaki]

Played about 20 hours now, I’m definitely happy that the puzzle element has mostly been kept to a minimum. 
 

Story has been interesting, the combat is opening up nicely now I’ve been getting more skills unlocked. 
 

Game of the year? Hard to say. But unlike Elden Ring, i’m actually having fun with it.

[AndyKurosaki]

Finished the story tonight. Certainly enjoyed the majority of this. Though I will say, the way combat skills work could have been explained a bit better. Some of the moves I personally found too complicated for their own good. My dyspraxia strikes again, but I’d often find I’d buy a new skill, try to remember how to use it, only to forget when in combat. I used a few moves for each weapon repeatedly, as I couldn’t remember how to use them in battle. Soon as I got the strong finishers that required multiple button presses, I thought “Yeah I’m never going to use them”. 
 

Most games will show you how to actually do new moves, in combat. This doesn’t. Still, it didn’t stop me having fun in my own way. 
 

Certainly not going to bother 100ing it. I can’t be arsed with collectibles most of the time. I found one optional boss midway through the story, that absolutely battered me. So that can fuck off. 
 

Not my game of the year, but still, it’s pretty good.

[one-armed dwarf]

Going to be drowsy tomorrow morning for work, just stayed up really late fighting this boss and shit was intense as fuck.

 

Pro tip, stab the bitch a lot. Don't watch unless in endgame or near the end.

 

Spoiler

 

 

 

That's 5 berserkers down, 7 more

 

Spoiler

 

 

This was another difficult one also, lots of adds. Same spoiler warning as above.

[DisturbedSwan]

The game just keeps getting better and better for me, after moaning a little in my last post of the prospect of more side quests to do, once I got into them I got utterly besotted doing them and others that came my way whilst exploring a new area associated with said aforementioned side quest. Just got utterly engrossed in this area, picking up all the collectibles in each zone and solving some cool puzzles along the way, the side quests themselves were utterly brilliant as well, especially the one I actually came to this area for, which again, shines a light and gives greater meaning to one of the main characters and their backstory. Absolutely extraordinary stuff.

 

The more I play this is heading more into my GOAT territory, let alone GOTY. What a game.

 

Lots of pics:

 

 

 

 

Location, Character and Boss spoilers enclosed.

Spoiler

 

Spoiler

 

[AndyKurosaki]

I had fun with this, but it’s not my GOTY, much less GOAT. I’ve seen people say they got really emotional about parts of the story, and were “brought to tears”. Maybe I’m a cynical old bastard, but I certainly didn’t. The story is really good, admittedly. But will I be playing anymore, now the credits have rolled? No. I can’t be arsed doing the collectibles. I got my arse kicked by the first optional boss. I’ve had my fun, now it’s on to something else. 
 

Don’t get me wrong, if people feel this is “10 out of 10, absolutely incredible”, fair does. It’s undeniably a good game. But in a few months, I’ll have forgotten most of it.

[one-armed dwarf]

There's like one scene I thought was pretty good, and I also think this game had a surprising ending

 

I don't really talk much about story stuff, cause I kind of agree with andy that it's all fairly typical AAA cinematic 'prestige gaming' stuff. But the things I did like

 

(obviously these are endgame spoilers)

 

Spoiler

This scene with Kratos seeing the image of himself being loved, an impossible thing to imagine in prior entries, and resolving himself to a new path (could not find a clip without a reaction andy, no offense to the actual andy above lol)

 

 

 

and for the surprising ending

 

Spoiler

I did not quite see them taking a character like Sindri, the comic relief guy, and basically having him not forgive the main characters for the part they play in Brok's death. 

 

It's just, you guys fucked it up, I live with this now and it's down to you. Credits roll (literally)

 

 

Which is a surprising thesis statement of Ragnarok, and these two games in particular. Yes Kratos is set on a better path but it will never make good the wrongs, or even the mistakes made in good conscience. It goes against the grain a little bit

 

[DisturbedSwan]

That’s fair enough @AndyKurosaki you’re entitled to your view. For me, the game has reached those high echelons and as mentioned in past posts it’s made me cry 3 or 4 times already. It’s a deeply moving story to me already and will (I imagine) become even more so the further I go into the game. 
 

The game has everything for me, I can’t fault it, it’s nigh on faultless, again, for me, so it’s a 10 and then the story and it’s ability to make me feel things outside of video gamey type ‘axe make me feel good!’ Type stuff puts it in my GOAT conversation at this time, but it could lose that or cement its place the further it goes on.