The Hot Topic Returns

[mfnick]

Atlus & Persona 5.

 

They weren’t really on my radar until P5. Now I’ll try anything they put out on console. To be honest if I’d tried Persona 3 or 4 first that would have done it too but I didn’t so P5 it is.  
 

Turn 10 & Forza Motorsport 4

 

I played Forza 1-3 and they were ok but nothing special. They definitely weren’t top tier. However FM4 was basically console sim racing perfection. It may still be my favourite one of those. 

 

Unfortunately they went a bit shit afterwards again but 4 was incredible & made me see them in another light.
 

& agree with @spatular with Evolution completely. 

[Sly Reflex]

Interesting that people went up instead of down.

 

Because that game for me was Battlefield 3 and DICE.

 

BF3 was dogshit. I can't think of one area where it excelled over previous BF games, it especially paled to Bad Company 2.

 

Online was broken as fuck. It was a buggy mess. The shooting was spongy and loose. It was an eyesore to look at. The menu's were overcomplicated. Squadding up was a nightmare. The maps were small. Unlock game design was a trudge. It was the antithesis of what a BF game should be, a duck shoot through door frames for the most, all the excellent progression learned from 10 years of refinement flushed down the toilet for a bastardised version of Call of Field. It was rubbish.

 

They managed to salvage it in BF4, but a lot of the rot had still taken root and was never going to go away. In many ways this design process lead us down the Star Wars loot box fiasco. There were flashes of brilliance of what DICE was, but it was pretty much in the rear view mirror by this point.

 

They span out Hardline, whatever the fuck that was meant to be. Visceral games rewarded by the good work they did repairing the shit DICE did with BF4 resulted in an abomination nobody asked for. A negative reception and loads of work turned it into a game people that played remember fondly for what it was and what it tried to do. Visceral were closed down for their efforts. This isn't really about Visceral though, I can't be mad at them for EA shunting them into a thing they were not set up for.

 

Everything after this was landfill.

 

BF1 took lessons from BF3, but instead of being a bastard child of BF and CoD it was a bastard child of Battlefield and Battlefront. To add insult to injury, DICE didn't learn from CoD's past mistakes with rewarding failure and promoting selfishness. They turned a game series that was always Us vs Them into Me vs K/D.

 

V came after. I didn't buy this one, but I had a lengthy spin of it round at friends. A similar clusterfuck of not knowing what it wants to be mixed in with a lot of questionable stuff.

 

That lead us right into 2042. Again, I didn't buy this one, but I watched friends play hundreds of hours over the course between it releasing and 6 coming out. This game was shocking, it should have killed the franchise. Each and every time I saw them stream this game it was a like a supercut  of memeworthy stuff going on, either the game breaking, or stuff not working how it should, people using exploits etc. As a viewer watching in it was hilarious, but as a person playing it, maybe not so much.

 

From what I understand, BF6 is quite good? Runs well on a potato and seems to be well received. I have no idea if this is still the case as I don't know anyone that's still playing it. It only took them 15 years. One third of my damn life to get back on track.

 

So yeah, DICE have gone down so much in my opinion. The company that hooked me in with Pinball Fantasies/Dreams, wowed me with Motorhead and went on to make the excellent RalliSport games. They also took a punt on one of the most aesthetically beautiful games in Mirror's Edge. All this while turning out Battlefield games too.

Then they became (mostly) a Battlefield factory and shit went sideways. Add it to the list of studios tasked to do one thing and one thing only and the law of diminishing returns.

 

If we're talking about feel good stories, Hello Games releasing silage like Joe Danger and then coming out with No Mans Sky to disastrous effect, but then over the years making good on promises. Even though I have never played, I respect that they rehabilitated the game and seem intent on supporting the game they made. At this point I feel like it's had as many updates as Terraria or Minecraft.

 

Actually chuck Digital Extremes on there for Warframe as well. 

[Sly Reflex]

Quote

Given the EA news, I thought about this question.

 

Which company would ruin your hobby most if you decided to boycott them? What line would they have to cross for you to draw a line in the sand and abandon them until a reversal of attitude was undertaken?

 

 

[Nag]

Capcom... if they did the unthinkable and became Switch 2 exclusive... shudder.

[one-armed dwarf]

Capcom also, if they were owned by PIF or, in some twisted circumstance, had something similar as Microsoft do with the use of Azure Cloud to do surveillance of Palestinians and provide post-facto justification for state murder, but this seems impossible as they don't have that kind of tech stack. Xbox is the only company this will happen with, unless Amazon became a big player, I don't know

 

The PIF scenario is a much more plausible one cause of how fighting games seem to attract attention, with SNK and Evo

 

I will say, with AI stuff, it's not something that would raise to the level of boycott for me cause this shit is everywhere in tech and I've already sort of accepted the slop, even with the morality issues surrounding AI. You can take for granted that every new Resident Evil has a .Claude file somewhere in its repos, every DMC or SF etc

[DANGERMAN]

It kind of already happened with SNK getting bought by Saudi. Especially as they then put out a seemingly really good Fatal Fury.

 

The big one though would probably be Valve. Whatever with the games because they don't really put out anything I play (prove me wrong Valve), but not being able to use Steam any more would be a huge problem. Again, it's probably be the ownership, I do worry a bit what will happen when Gabe goes

[Maf]

I’m not in full boycott mode yet but companies not supporting physical media is a big one for me.
 

I’m already semi-boycott on Switch 2 as I refuse to buy any Game Keycard. I understand in certain cases why they do that when the cartridge itself is a technical limitation. But in that case I will buy it on a disc on another platform. Publishers just being cheap, most noticeably The Pokemon Company and Pokopia, like get the fuck out. 
 

If Nintendo themselves start only doing Game Keycards I will be in a pickle 

 

Also facing down the same problem with PlayStation and no more discs. I am so upset that the fucking company that set the standard for discs as a format is taking it away. I really hope the next Xbox supports discs in some way, even with an optional disc drive, because I will just move to that. 
 

I don’t hate digital or anything and for small devs/publishers where digital only makes sense, that’s cool. But these big companies like Sony practicing what I think is anti-consumer by not having physical versions is a big deal to me. Even more so when consoles are looking down the economic gun barrel and Sony is making the case for them even worse. 
 

I’m really looking at what PlayStation makes and I think except for Spider-Man 3 I can live without their product. They are also going to have to pull some magic rabbit out of a hat to get me to buy a PS6 without discs. Like, you better have a really good trick up your sleeve or impress in a major way to substitute for this. Because no discs to me is potentially a deal breaker. It already will be when they stop printing discs for PS5 and I start buying all my physical media on Xbox/Nintendo. 

[DANGERMAN]

Yeah I'm with you on both of them @Maf. I won't buy a Game Card unless it's going incredibly cheap 2nd hand. And I'm already working on the assumption that I'm not getting the next Playstation 

 

As an aside, game key cards, premium pricing, Nintendo have done all of that, so I'm not sure why I'm seeing videos saying things like "Nintendo are the last hold out" 

[shinymcshine]

Problem is not actually having any sort of moral control over ownership models or workplace ethics (i.e. even companies which seem pretty decent end up with workers going through burnout at crunch delivery times etc).

 

So, politely, I just continue to buy whatever I want, generally at sale rather than full price, and mostly digital nowadays - but I would still avoid any sort of pay-to-win / incremental DLC type game models

[Maryokutai]

As for the company, probably Nintendo, because they're both a console manufacturer and make games I like on the regular (even if less so in recent years). For me to boycott them they probably would have to turn into what MS and Sony are right now combined, meaning no more physical releases, questionable financial investments (wars, AI) and appalling treatment of their workforce. Realistically I can only see one of those things happen to Nintendo, and not in the foreseeable future.

 

For publishers/developers it's a bit more muddy for me. Crystal Dynamics, for example, has more or less come out and said they're using AI during conceptual phases of their games now. Which, admittedly, probably a lot of studios do without disclosing it. But they've also been victims of layoffs, so AI might have been the only way to keep productivity going. It's also probably safe to assume the fortunes of the studio are resting entirely on the next Tomb Raider doing well after both Avengers and Perfect Dark. So what good would a boycott realistically accomplish here, except allowing me to give myself a pat on the back for sticking to my principles as a very anti-AI person? 

 

It's probably clearer for situations like with EA now – I wasn't uninterested in the Star Wars tactics game, but I'm not going to pick that one up and I feel like Respawn will be okay if I don't. But weighing purchase decisions of entertainment products against your moral compass is the kind of question I could frankly live without. Videogames have become such a toxic topic to think about.

[mfnick]

Sony for me, especially if it includes hardware. Xbox are done and Nintendo just don’t appeal to me.

I want to boycott them now for various reasons but I just can’t. & their release cadence has gone to shit but they still produce the games I love most - stuff like Astro Bot, Yotei, Spider-Man 2 just the best shit I’ve played this gen. & Wolverine is easily my most anticipated game announced so far. 
 

If we’re talking strictly just publishers it’d be between Capcom and Sega. I’d actually lean towards Sega because of Yakuza, Persona and their more recent classic revival stuff like Streets of Rage 4 & Shinobi being fucking brilliant. 

[Sly Reflex]

The more I think about it the more complicated I think it is. And also I am going to ramble a lot. Stay if you want. Skip if you need.

 

Effectively I already have 2 boycotts in place right now. I don't buy any EA stuff because I'm not fucking about with their launcher, and same for Ubisoft. Not that either company are brimming with stuff I am clambering to play, but I'd quite like to do the Hazelight stuff at some point. EA in particular can always take a big fat fuck off, ever since the early 00's they've been an awful company. Ubisoft trundled there by being complacent and arrogant. These companies have been a net negative for decades when you combine them.

 

I did boycott Activision between MW and Destiny, with the only caveat that I bought Geometry Wars 2 when that came out. Activision released a lot of interesting stuff then that wasn't their main bread and butter that I regret missing out on, but at the same time it's not like I didn't have a wealth of stuff to play outside that. Maybe the side scrolling Prince of Persia game that tanked.

 

The whole no physical argument is interesting to me as well, since the last few games I did buy in physical are essentially coasters now. Overwatch, Division II and Anthem. There might be other games as well in that line up, but those are the ones I'm making an example of. Digital is the way it's been going for a long time and as shitty as it is the hardware guys kicking out the last few is the equivalent of throwing those last few people out that won't leave way after the party is over. The last physical game I bought on PC that would start right now if I threw it in a drive was Civ 4. When I went driveless on whatever build I put together when I built a new PC I emailed Firaxis about the good times I had playing the game, they thanked me for sharing my story and sent steam keys so I could carry on playing for free.

 

I think for me the real kicker would be not taking part in business practices that seem shitty. Doesn't really matter if it was any of the companies everyone else named, I just don't want to be a part of that.

 

I am out of the Nintendo ecosystem and I'll never go back. More power to the people that go back console after console, but it's more of the same with a touch up. I feel like if you are a kid then fair enough, if you're an adult over a certain age, you've seen it all. To share that wonder with your own kids must be magical though. I fully understand people that do that.

 

I am out of the Sony ecosystem. I can't say I care for the stuff they have that much that I would be willing to drop anywhere between 500 and nearly 800(?!?) on a console, nor will I be willing to spend potentially more than that when the PS6 comes out. I would have have bought games published by them on steam, but that's out the window now, so I'm not going to worry about it too much The more I hear from Sony the more I think they have lost the plot. Gone are the days where I see something and think of it a common W for Sony. Not that I think it will bother "Gamers" because MS has effectively torpedoed themselves. I don't think these consumers are in the market for anything Nintendo (unless they have kids), I don't think MS will manage to be the cool option (although I thought that with One vs PS4 and I still knew people that favoured that shitbox over the PS4.) and the Steam machine has two things going against it, 1 is that console people are terrified of "PC" stuff because they think it's too complicated and 2. the spec will be under what players expect. That perception of wanting power is always desirable even though ether's no correlation between games.

 

I want to say I am not on board with MS, but I sort of am because of the whole PC thing. I do think that as Linux comes on in leaps and bounds and more things are adopting it than are going against it now. Couple that with Windows being absolute fucking toss it's very likely that W11 will be the last MS OS I ever use. I'm in no danger of ever buying another Xbox console, The Xbox one is the second worst console I've ever used (after the Wii) and the short times I spent with the Xbox after left a lot to be desired. It was, and all the other consoles are, a DRM machine you pay out the ass for. Not since the 360 has a console felt like it was for the gamers.

 

Steam and Valve. I'm not the person to buy a steam machine, so I'm just going to ignore that. As for steam as a service, what concerns me is what happens when Gabe pops his clogs. I presume there's some sort of manifesto left behind that dictates how the company should be run and I would hope that it would be a "it's not broken so don't fix it" way of operation, but if we've learned anything, when money is involved, and vast amount of it are, things can and will go tits up. There's so many promises been made to companies when they change leadership that either degrade the instance the new CEO turns up, or there's a slow delve into enshittification. 

 

I do think that should this happen there's still a lot of places that games could be acquired from, it's not like Steam is the only show on the road. It would/will be devastating it it did/had happened though.

 

Outside of this, I don't really want to bend my knee to anything that is shitty to the consumer in ways that effects the QoL for the person buying and playing the games. No mandatory accounts needed outside the one you buy the game on, no storefronts on games or launchers where unneeded. All that superfluous stuff can go. If you're going to put roadblocks in front of me playing the game I legally purchased, then I'm just going to pirate it and black ball you from further purchases in future. If I can't do that, I'm sure as fuck going to warn every single person I know with my experience so others won't make the same mistake.

 

I do believe given the parameters that, aside from cost of entry because of rocketing prices for hardware, people would always have somewhere to go should the competition not align with boundaries you have set as an individual.

 

One thing that I am intrigued to find out about is what happens when everything is digital and you get banned in a game. Does it just effect that game? The whole account? What happens if you try and buy another copy of that game? Is it removed from your library? For instance, if you got banned playing The Division, does that just extent to the Dark Zone, or are we talking a whole revoking of the game itself, since you need to sign in.

If you got banned from a game for whatever reason, how would you go about it?

[radiofloyd]

If I go through some developers of games I like:

 

Nintendo - for me that would effectively mean no Zelda and no Fire Emblem, I can’t see myself ever boycotting Zelda so that’s a no

 

Monolith Soft - I’m not really a player who buys games at launch anymore so I’m always going to be a few games behind with most developers on this list, but again I can’t see myself boycotting Xenoblade

 

From Software - Elden Ring was the first “average” game I think they’ve made, and even then I sank 150 hours into it without finishing it, or the DLC. Can’t see myself ever boycotting From

 

CD Projekt Red - Absolutely loved The Witcher trilogy and Cyberpunk so absolutely no chance I’m boycotting them

 

Square-Enix - Their output isn’t the gold stand it was in the PS1/PS2 days but still, can’t see myself ignoring Final Fantasy or Dragon Quest

 

Supergiant Games - still haven’t played Hades 2 but Transistor and Hades have made me a fan for life, so again, very unlikely

 

Team Cherry - Now that some time has passed I often think about returning to Silksong, especially with more content coming. Again, almost no chance I could boycott their next game

 

Larian Games - If their next game is another huge multi-act rpg, I might approach it differently and take breaks between acts to avoid burnout, but still, no chance I’m not picking up the next Divinity game

 

 

[one-armed dwarf]

I mean, it's pretty hard to think of a situation where Team Cherry do something bad enough to cause people to boycott them 🤔

 

Perhaps a 

Spoiler

third Trobbio fight in the DLC.

Put them in the Hague for that shit if it happens

[Sly Reflex]

Quote

 

We're now less than 100 days to Grand Theft Auto 6 coming out. What do you expect from the game when it lands? Would you like to make any predictions? Stuff like songs on the radio, reoccurring characters, story beats or overall themes are welcome.

 

Take a prediction on it. No matter how mild or out there. We'll come back to this once the games been out a bit and see if anyone Nostradamus'd it.

 

 

[one-armed dwarf]

Not having played gtav, it's hard to predict stuff. Is Lazlo still doing the radio stations?

 

The story looks like Bonnie and Clyde, but I bet they subvert it and have both the main characters survive

[shinymcshine]

After VC & SA both IV and V felt that they took away as much as they gave back - I still look back with more fondness at those earlier games, inc replaying them way more than the latter ones - and never playing online either.

 

I enjoyed the open world sandbox elements of Saints Row (2022) but it really was more like playing a retro game, the gameplay arc of mixing main missions with side tasks felt achingly old school, especially when the reward / risk of each were seldom interelated - so maybe that's what I'd like to see in GTA VI, a living breathing world where actions and consequences have actually in-game impact, and not just as a result of main mission progress.

 

But.... I really don't have much expectation or enthusiasm for it all currently, if all it delivers is a brighter shinier GTA V then it'll be a huge disappointment.

[Sly Reflex]

Might be able to make some really accurate predictions given what happened today.  

[one-armed dwarf]

I predict that the game will control and move like total ass, similar to RDRII

[DANGERMAN]

17 hours ago, Sly Reflex said:

Might be able to make some really accurate predictions given what happened today.  

has it leaked (again) or something?