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The Hot Topic Returns


Nag
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1 hour ago, Nag said:

that want as many people as possible to play them all the way to the end.

I've always been confused by that mindset. As if difficulty is the antithesis of mass market appeal. Surely that is what a difficulty curve is for? Maybe that is coming from 8 bit gaming. Wherein gamer skill was built on overcoming difficulty. Your Castlevanias, Contra, Mega Man's etc

 

As for the question, I can't really think of any game I've played that's easy? Since it isn't something I look for. Mario Odyssey, possibly? Since the hardest levels are post-main game. It is what it is, when it comes to platformers though.

 

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Most recent Nintendo games. Especially the Mario ones. They’re so easy they become boring. With the best stuff saved until completion and the following bonus levels. Thing is I’m done with the game by that point and have probably lost interest. Or there’s not much left anyway. I also don’t want to have to replay levels for the extra coins or whatever to unlock the good levels or play 10 easy boring hours to get to the good stuff. 

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18 minutes ago, mfnick said:

Thing is I’m done with the game by that point and have probably lost interest.

Same. As soon as that final boss is dead, I'm done with the game. I move on to the next.  All that post-game, NG+ stuff just never interested me.

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sorry to repeat what others have said, but Mario Odyssey was the first game that came to mind. It's really well made, but too much of it just feels like a procession

 

There were a few games on the DS that suffered with a lack of difficulty. I really liked the Nodame Catabile game, but it was so, so easy, the rhythm sections were basically unfailable 

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It depends on if a game has good mechanics or not. Games can still be excellent even if they're free of penalty. Like Ghost of Tsushima is a game that is brain dead easy. But the reason it's bad is because it's a dumb 50 hours of swiping the touch pad and pushing triangle. Luckily it's got incredible art/graphics, a easy platinum, and when I was playing it a raging pandemic for it to coast on but it's not bad because it's easy, it's bad because it's one note stupid. 

 

Then there are games like Kirby this year which is hard to die in even if you were trying but it's so much fun to play because the mechanics are good, the challenges are fun to do, the secrets are fun to find. It's engaging without being difficult. I think this is a mark of an incredible game because it goes to show just how well it's made. 

 

Beyond that I think there are games that are all about the show and not the ball busting. I still like Call of Duty because it's a fun rollercoaster. Rollercoasters aren't about death or struggle. If it were it would be a bad rollercoaster and make the game worse *Cough*Uncharted 3*Cough*

 

For me great games can be easy as long as it's fun to play 

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I think if you want a challenge there is a subsection of games that really cater to that but I generally don't go into games thinking it's going to be difficult, or even always look for it.  Especially with a Mario game because they've never been that hard.  They are when you first play them, I got rekt by that first Goomba the first time I played SMW because of a badly controlled jump.  This was a different family members SNES and I'd only played Sonic that is a game like this so the jump felt weird.

 

 

I think that's such an under looked thing, games feel easier now because we've played more games and have lots of experience.  I'd wager Mario Odyssey probably feels not too far away from what SMW did to me as to a 7 y/o who has barely played other games when they play Odyssey.  But to me it's a tight controlling, imaginative and fun time and SMBW is the same but I can play it with my eyes closed.  I consider neither of these hard games.

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Bioshock stands out to me as a game where the lack of difficulty really hurt it. The immersive sim elements were already extremely weak in that game and feel more like a kind of token nod to the legacy of games it cribbed its influences from, but the vita chambers make the whole thing even more extremely stupid. There is a 'brass balls' achivement for turning them off, but even at that Bioshock's rpg and fps mechanics amount to little more than an occasional distraction from a tour in a genuinely cool world.

 

I think certain kinds of games, especially ones in the same genre as Bioshock, they need a little bit of 'friction' to reward people for learning the systems put in place. Friction is imo a more useful term cause not every game needs it, a casual platformer for kids needs very little of it so it's fine that these are easy games. It's not something I'd be looking for in Mario anyway, if I ever bothered to play one (I won't).

 

A good step forward is stuff like TLOU2 and Guardians of the Galaxy which put every single difficulty modifier on a separate dial if you choose. Not that Guardians scales well on 'hard', but games should imo just put the choice in the player's hands, and even let them use cheats if need be. That's what I think about difficulty anyway. Not everyone wants the ultra rambo survivalist experience from TLOU and it's good they can turn things all the way down (or some of the way) and get more quickly to the narrative side of the experience. In Guardians I would suggest that it is a must that you play it on easy

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It's been a while since I played Mass Effect but I think I would have liked it to be a better game at higher difficulties.  I think I remember it being poorly balanced nonsense while being very casual on normal.  Maybe it would get better as you level up and get your abilities but early game is a slog.  I got that from BioShock too.

 

I've heard developers say it's really easy to make a hard game but I don't think I agree with that.  It's easy to make a bullshit unfair game but I've tried to many at higher difficulties that are not satisfying while a few do manage it.

 

Lots of old games fall in that bullshit 'the programmer can do it' difficulty so I'm glad that's less of a thing because it's just not good craft.  

 

I've said before but Pokémon games could do with multiple difficulty settings.  The audience does include old heads at this point too and I don't think it needs to be super hardcore but just a mode that remixes enemy teams to stuff that is a bit more dangerous wouldn't be the worst use of dev time.

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I don't think Pokemon needs to be more difficult, but it could do with starting faster. They're still a "my first RPG" for a lot of kids so I get why they can be so slow. But they could do with a solution where if it's not your first RPG you can experience the beginning. Meet the characters, have the set up, get your first Pokemon and stuff. But condensed to like 20 minutes. 

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I think Pokémon should be more difficult by allowing the AI to properly use its mechanics. It's nice to run into a gym leader who specialise in the Poison type so you can learn about it, but why does he keep using Toxic when you're already poisoned? And that brainless usage of typings and attacks follows you through every game from start to finish. 

 

Not sure if I can think of anything else. Kirby is always easy but I don't think those games would be better if they were hard. Maybe an odd one to throw in the mix, but Steamworld Quest was designed in a way that the brute-force method of powering up your fire cards was the easiest and most straightforward approach to beating pretty much every enemy in that game, which makes the last two characters that join you feel extremely redundant with their sophisticated combos. But that's probably more of a design issue than one about difficulty.

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23 minutes ago, Maryokutai said:

I think Pokémon should be more difficult by allowing the AI to properly use its mechanics. It's nice to run into a gym leader who specialise in the Poison type so you can learn about it, but why does he keep using Toxic when you're already poisoned? And that brainless usage of typings and attacks follows you through every game from start to finish. 

 

They lightly do this in the newer games a bit. The gym leaders in SS use weather effects and the legendary of the game's ability gives it one attack raise when it hits the field and then it usually does Swords Dance so it's +3 and you're fucked. It's the first legendary in a long time I caught with a Master Ball because I just couldn't be assed, it's too difficult. 

 

If others want Pokemon to be harder swap out your Pokemon. The whole point of the game is to be a Pokemon Master but most people master the first 6 Pokemon they catch and then go "The game is too easy". 

 

My answer and it has been for a long time is the game should scale with you. Like the gym leader's Pokemon should always be the level of your strongest Pokemon then you have to type/tactics through the fight instead of overpowering with levels. 

 

Which given that Scarlett and Violet don't have a linear pathway like older games I think there's good chance this will be the solution.  

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That, or they could Metroid it. You start strong with a powerful team of PokéMon. Then lose them all to a Legendary (or some such) and have to start from scratch? A mid-game twist, perhaps??

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Agree with people who mentioned kirby, thats the easiest game ive played recently, and it was great. Oddly also played an old gbc motion controlled kirby game that was probably one of the hardest games ive played recently.

 

i often play games on easy mode, like fps games like cod or something, just running through kicking ass is fun. I dont like dying and being put back to retry the same bit over and over in games like that. But i do like that when the games designed around replaying short sections that are difficult, like super meat boy, or the recent neon white.

 

i usually find mario games to be quite difficult, but i am rubbish at platformers.

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Spider-Man is a great example of a low difficulty level that doesn't hurt the experience, I think.

 

Yeah, you can bump it up in difficulty, but the gameplay loop itself has this popcorn-munching quality where you can just run along for the ride without worrying too much about hitting a brick wall.

 

I reckon if it had been tweaked to be more difficult it wouldn't have the magic it does. You really feel like this slippery little bastard who the bad guys just can't get a grip of. The platinum is incredibly easy to achieve, too.

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Spider-Man has the Batman combat where you can either mash or play it really skilfully though. So even if you find it easy it’s got room for the player to test and challenge themselves to do really long combos or never touch the floor or stuff like that.

 

I agree making it harder wouldn’t make it better but just to say one of the great things about that game is it’s easy but can be skilful at the same time 

 

Like I was saying before games don’t need to be hard to be engaging. Being difficult works to keep the player present and paying attention but a well made game can do that without the need to threaten death all the time 

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sotcse_screen_ps4_psx17_7_1512804663.jpg

 

Quote

Readers debate their favourite PlayStation only games from across the years, from Metal Gear Solid to Bloodborne.

 

The subject for this week’s Hot Topic was suggested by reader Tosh, who was inspired by the recent launch of PS Plus Premium and its easy access to classic PlayStation titles. Although any game that was exclusive at the time of release qualified, whether it was made by Sony or not.

 

Lots of games, for almost every PlayStation format, were mentioned, although with a particular bias towards the original PlayStation and the most recent two consoles. Which suggests that while nostalgia is strong Sony is still hitting the right notes.

 

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PSOne: Alundra, Vandal Hearts, Suikoden 1 & 2, Breath of Fire 3 & 4, Soul Blade, Tekken 1-3, Front Mission 3, FF7-9, MGS, Medievil, Oddworld 1 & 2, Omega Boost, Tenchu 1 & 2.

 

PS2: Ico, SoTC, God of War 1 & 2, Dragon Quest 8, Rogue Galaxy, MGS 2, Suikoden 4 & 5

 

PS3: Demon Souls, 3D Dot Game Heroes, Infamous 1 & 2

 

PS5: Returnal - so far

 

That's all that immediately come to mind. Some have since become multi-platform ala RE and Silent Hill. So they don't really count.

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