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Wasn't Elvis meant to be a bit of a predator? I mean not on the magnitude of MJ, but there' was some dubious shit going on there. Why no calls for his music to be pulled? Maybe because there's a whole foundation of stuff resting on it making money? That estate is still pulling bank decades after the guys death and I suspect MJ's would be or will be too.

 

I personally think that rights and likenesses and all that should expire so no money can be made for it years after the demise of the last creators. I don't see why people should be able to cash in on other peoples entertainment work miles down the line. That's an whole other argument though, one that will never come to fruition because money.

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Also I’m a huge Led Zeppelin fan but it’s well known that Jimmy Page likes ‘em young.

Like 14 years old, young.

 

In the Hammer of the Gods book, he got with a 14 year old American groupie, met her family and everything. And the book portrays her as being the aggressive one, watching out for other would-be groupies. 

 

I still love that band, but it’s a difficult one to get your head around. All you can tell yourself is “it was a different time....” but it doesn’t make it any less grim.

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I've not watched the documentary yet, but it's on my list.

I remember watching a few programs from around his death though.

On a side note I remember listening to an interview with Robbie Williams, he was talking about how much he struggled with being famous, and the fallout of being dumped out the back of the hype engine. Coming from someone who had a fairly normal upbringing then got surrounded by people wanting to keep you as an asset to make money. I remember hearing similar stories of Brian Harvey.

Now imagine that same pressure but on a child, and them never being allowed to be a child.

I don't really think it's that much of a stretch of the imagination to see how messed up someone could get with a seemingly endless amount of money, with an abusive father,  was never allowed to be a child, and is forever surrounded either by paparazzi trying to force their way into every facet of their existence as well as a fleet of "yes" men 

Not that this excuses any behaviour on anyone's part...

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1 hour ago, Hendo said:

Also I’m a huge Led Zeppelin fan but it’s well known that Jimmy Page likes ‘em young.

 

Townshend as well of The Who fame. It's all rumoured and I don't think there's been anything super solid from what I've seen, but the whole group have walked out of interviews when it's been brought up. It seems to be a touchy subject around them.

 

On the other hand, can you imagine being brought into allegations like that if you are innocent? It's a life fucker. The Hunt shows what a scary prospect that can be if you're just a normal person that ends up on the end of nasty rumours. Now imagine that, but on a global scale.

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^^

Indeed, there was this bizarre  story a couple of  years ago  about a guy who brushed past a famous actress at a busy station, and was put on trial for  a  serious sexual assault with minimal  evidence -- whilst subsequently cleared he was named, whilst she remains  anonymous.

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/12144963/Commuter-who-walked-past-actress-at-Waterloo-station-cleared-of-bizarre-sex-assault-claim.html

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We've been here before, haven't we? A "victim" bandwagon people are all too happy to jump on, without thinking seriously first.

@DifferentClass I'm cynical of 'trial by media' and not for or against "Wacko Jacko". Nor do I have any plans to see this documentary.

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It's not just jumping on a bandwagon without thinking.  There is plenty of evidence that shows something at least doesn't add up.  There is a very real culture of people using money to cover up stuff like this.  Some might say defending the likes of Jackson and others from public scrutiny is also jumping on a bandwagon.

 

And its funny you accuse others of not thinking then admit you're not interested in seeing the documentary, so you have no basis for telling people what is brought up hasn't been explored thoroughly, like the duration of the doc is just a flashing message saying "Jacko is Guilty".

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The "not thinking" part was in relation to what @shinymcshine was talking about. People are all too quick to accuse, when in serious crimes, the accusation is enough to condemn, whether innocent or guilty in the court of public opinion.

Regarding Michael Jackson, court cases and accusation that removed him from the airwaves already happened when he was alive. No one even spoke his name in years. He died as his coffers were run dry, relatively speaking. I question the merit of "public scrutiny" when the accused is long dead, other than catering to people's thirst for sensationalism and/or notoriety.

 

I read an interesting article on some of the victims of Jimmy Saville. They went unnamed and unphotographed. When asked about telling their story, they merely stated they moved on and found closure in his death. They were horrified when everything started to be splashed across the headlines, because then they knew it would never end for them. Which is very sad. 

 

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I don't remember Jackson being shunned before he died, more that he hadn't done anything of any worth in years.

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7 minutes ago, Hendo said:

I don't remember Jackson being shunned before he died, more that he hadn't done anything of any worth in years.

The Cause and effect, that the last court case had led to.

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I mean, I'm going back as far as Dangerous and Earth Song. They were rubbish and no-one cared.

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Before and After that, realistically. He fell in and out of favour constantly since the mid 90's to be fair. Which revolved around the accusations and subsequent court cases ...and the weird shite like Oxygen Tank rumours, That Face etc

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him being a weirdo helped him too. Someone in this thread has repeated the line about him not having a proper childhood, which I think is a line of reasoning a lot of us ascribed to a few years ago. It excused a lot of how he was, still does for some people, and you can see why. You're famous, can't trust anyone, end up finding companionship in people too young to be cynical, it's an easy logic even if the next step shouldn't get excused

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Plus if half the stories about his piece of shit Dad are true, it explains alot about all of them. I remember the day after he died, they asked his Dad at a conference to make a statement (on his dead son) he instead, used the exposure to plug the new act he was working on. Utter tosser. Kind of like how his own fairly recent death went completely unremarked.

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I watched the documentary yesterday. The bit with the dad was awful, he had his life ruined all because of the temptation of meeting a star and living in the States. 

 

As for Jackson, he assaulted those kids. The documentary doesn't do a great job of laying out the evidence, and you can see why people liked him, he seemed like a nice guy if you ignore the sexual assault of children. 

 

He's been accused by 5 boys who he slept in the same bed with, some of those he spent weeks sleeping with. If he wasn't a celebrity no one would be under any reasonable doubt about it 

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1 hour ago, shinymcshine said:

Put this here for an interesting bit of balance:

 

https://www.forbes.com/sites/joevogel/2019/01/29/what-you-should-know-about-the-new-michael-jackson-documentary/#338a7fc640fa

 

No doubt that somewhere between this and the documentary lies the truth, just depends where on the pendulum you believe that is.

 

that piece is basically the Reddit quote that started this thread, it's got as much critical evidence in it as the documentary. I didn't post it, but I saw a video yesterday of Jackson buying the wedding ring with the kid, he got pulled by mall security because he was in disguise and looked shifty, it made local news. They also do put the change of heart in context in the documentary, it doesn't mean it's true obviously but as the writer/blogger says he hasn't watched it at the time of writing, it's not something they ignore

 

I will say though, credit to him for not fucking the kid with AIDS

 

 

@shinymcshine that might read like I'm having a go at you there, I'm not :)

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